Komen foundation & Planned Parenthood

[FM7]

Amen Hog Caller!

[YellowRose]

Amen Hog Caller!

Hog Caller is spot on. His niece is an extraordinary young woman and wisdom must run in the family.

[caymen]

FM7-"Don't you think the women should at least get an informed choice? PP does all they can to limit the info, so they won't change their minds."

I'd like to ask how you know this? Do you have a lot of experience with Planned Parenthood? I do personally. I have not had an abortion, never needed an abortion, but I know people who have. A couple of the people who had abortions feel a great deal of regret today, one expressed it to me recently, the other is now a prolife advocate ( she had several abortions) the other people I knew who had abortions know they made the right decisions, one was very young, the other two wanted babies but encountered terrible health problems.
I used Planned Parenthood as my healthcare provider for several years when I was young and my experience does not reflect what you say at all. In fact they went out of their way to inform and educate both male and female patients about their bodies, birth control options and always included the statement that abstinance was the only 100% method. They intended to prevent as many abortions as possible, they did not see abortion as the wonderful thing you guys seem to suggest they do. In fact they did everything in their power to prevent unwanted pregnancy and disease.
In fact where I lived we had Planned Parenthood and a Problem Pregnancy center, Planned Parenthood did not provide abortions at that location but could tell you where you could go if it was needed ( we had not in town provider), they preferred prevention. The Problem Pregnancy Center only provided pregnancy tests for those who feared they might be pregnant and only gave results to those who agreed to watch a film on abortion including graphic late term abortion proceedures. They provided no birth control counceling but instead did do a nice job of traumatizing already upset unmarried young women. ( I knew someone who went there unaware) Who exactly has a one sided approach? But of course if you agree with the approach its okay.

BTW Bravo to your neice - every young woman faced with such a difficult situation should be able to make it through with such grace and success. But she should be able to do it by her own choice. If you can't trust a woman with a choice how can you trust her with a baby.

[Common Sense Al]

As if that situation doesn't happen and the woman ends up just as happy as your niece, even though the decision was different.

And how many times has abortion worked out for the other person involved, that is, the unborn child? How many aborted people are happy that they were aborted and would say that it worked out for them?

[skiing1974]

Amen Hog Caller and caymen!
Al, if there is 1, it is enough for the argument.

[FM7]

Caymen,
There are so many testimonials out there. Former abortion providers, doctors, counselors, women who had abortions, etc. Many were strong pro-choice. What is their motivation for coming out now? Seems like you had a good experience. However, if you are interested there is a lot out there that paints a very different picture.

[skiing1974]

FM7, you mean there are different pictures? Wow, sounds like a choice to me.

[josh]

Hog Caller, sorry to hear about the niece, glad she made a decision that worked for her and the baby in this case. It is one happy example. She had a choice and decided to keep it. That's all I am saying, choice that woman has. Al right away jumps into what if she had gone the other way and concludes only regrets would be there. As if that situation doesn't happen and the woman ends up just as happy as your niece, even though the decision was different. In Al's life, woman would not be able to decide and each woman goes through a different story.

It drives me insane to keep reading you guys talk about "women deciding" while you conveniently exclude the decision of the women (or even man) inside the mother. Can someone please give me a reason why life should not be protected at all stages?

And quit with the "we dont know when life begins" argument. It is rubbish.
Is it growing? Then it is alive. Is it human? Then it deserves protection.
From the second that the cell grows it has ALL of the DNA needed to produce a fully grown human. There is not some magical date in the womb at which it "becomes life" or "becomes human".

You people seem to be making an argument that rights do not apply to this particular human because of its size, location, level of development, dependence, etc. If that is the case, then lets apply that reasoning to human who are located outside their mother, and have a level of development less than others. The reasoning falls apart then.

[skiing1974]

Said it before, don't care for the definition when the life begins more than for the opportunity for a woman to choose. How's that? Now you answer, why shouldn't an adult being outside of womb have a choice, especially in instances mention here before? And lastly, drives me insane men telling women they shouldn't have a choice over their own body, rather men deciding about women's bodies. I am the one giving them a choice, who is anyone not to? And if someone inside of the womb should decide, I am cool with that, please go ahead and propose how that decision will be made.

[FM7]

Josh, I don't disagree with you.

However, I am only discussing the issue of "choice". Many women (and men) are not aware of what they may go through after an abortion, and the very people that are providing them abortion 'counseling' refuse to provide them after-abortion counseling. Why wouldn't they tell them what may happen? Considering how much they claim to care about women and their right to choose, it is ridiculous that they leave out this information since they may decide not to proceed with the abortion. On the other hand, there are pro-life organizations that provide the healing afterwards.

[Common Sense Al]

Now you answer, why shouldn't an adult being outside of womb have a choice, especially in instances mention here before?

Why shouldn't the unborn child have a choice? If you are so "for choice", then you need to give the unborn child a choice too. Why should the woman have a choice but not the child (who might also be female, by the way, since that seems to matter in your logic)?

If the child is female, then it's "her body" (as used by the pro-abortion side)... so why does the mother get to choose to rip the child's body to shreds when it's not hers? I thought you were for a woman's right to choose... if that were true, then any female unborn children should be able to choose whether or not to be aborted ("pro-choice" you know).

Hey wait! Maybe that means I am "PRO-CHOICE" after all! I want the unborn child to be able to choose whether he/she is aborted!

[FM7]

FM7, you mean there are different pictures? Wow, sounds like a choice to me.

Sounds like a choice with blinders on - just like PP likes it....

[skiing1974]

I answered that Al, then go ask whoever is in the womb about the choice, do not assume their choice. If they say they want to continue, by all means.

[Common Sense Al]

I answered that Al, then go ask whoever is in the womb about the choice, do not assume their choice. If they say they want to continue, by all means.

Hey, that's great... let's not assume their choice... unless they say 'yes', then they can't be slaughtered. They have to give explicit approval. After all, it's their body that is being torn apart and that should require EXPLICIT approval.

But you could use science to assume their choice (if one were going to try to assume). Science shows that the unborn child will try to escape whatever instrument is trying to tear them apart, so that could safely be considered a 'no'. Science also says that life, in general, tries to avoid harm and death.

Pretty logical & scientific, eh?

[FM7]

Using that criteria, we can kill a one day old baby since they won't answer either when we ask them if they want to live.