Gas Prices - here we go again?

[Common Sense Al]

How how will gas prices go this time? How much damage will it do to the economy? We are still way too dependent on foreign energy.

This may be a huge boost to the new electric cars coming on the market. Imagine not ever having to go to the gas pump.

Thoughts? Thinking about buying an all-electric car? Anyone have one here?

I hope the chaos in the Middle East will settles down "in a good way" for the people, but whether it does or not, we are still too dependent on foreign energy.

[Uther]

Have you tried looking into the feasibility of owning an all-electric car? We won't even get a diesel-powerd car because it is not trivial to find a gas station offering diesel.

Imagine owning a vehicle with a "drop-dead" range. And no charging stations anywhere in sight. You can't charge them when you're parked at work, when you're parking for shopping, etc. Nada. So you have to be tethered to home and go home frequently enough to be able to charge your little go-around. And for that you have to pay a premium?

I'll stick to my gas-powered hybrid while waiting for hydrogen fuel cell vehicles, TYVM.

[Common Sense Al]

Imagine owning a vehicle with a "drop-dead" range. And no charging stations anywhere in sight. You can't charge them when you're parked at work, when you're parking for shopping, etc. Nada. So you have to be tethered to home and go home frequently enough to be able to charge your little go-around.

Of course those are real concerns. I have no plans to buy an electric car in the immediate future, but it is something I will most likely consider the next time it's car-buying time. By then, I hope they will be a lot more models available and they will all have decent ranges and improved tech that it won't be such a concern. Plus, I bet new charging stations will start popping up all over the place.

And for that you have to pay a premium?

No, you pay a premium for not having to go to the gas station and buy gas.

I don't think electric cars are going away like they did last time... this time they are here to stay.

[Brian]

Have you tried looking into the feasibility of owning an all-electric car?

Its really only feasible IF you have another gas powered vehicle for long(er) distance travels.

Although I can see having one car that can get you to Flower Mound and back to be reasonable option. How many in Lantana, on a Saturday, head over to Highland Village and back again and thats it? Probably quite a few.

[Common Sense Al]

I would think a car with 100 mile range could be used 90%+ of the time for most people. Who drives more than 100 miles in one day? And if so, how often do you do that? We hardly ever do that.

[evblazer]

Argh.. Must contain myself. (I actually did I cut out tons of stuff through all my edits)

Ok let me first say I'm basically a card carrying member of the electric auto association (EAA) though I'm still a member of the new england chapter and have been since middle school? I've been to many meetings, races and EV conversion parties so I know alot of sad history on the whole EV thing.

So with that lengthy disclaimer I should mention I no longer have any EVs Got rid of 1 when they closed the parking lot I used and biked it, 1 when I moved cross country and another when they nearly tripled my commute so bicycle again Bicycles I know but I did do long distance cycling so 44 mile round trip was nice training for me. EVs have their pros and cons and I'd love to have one again but really would prefer one in the 2 or 3 wheel variety.

Now the nissan leaf and chevy volt are out or coming to TX. There are some little companies making some good EVs but I really think the only chance for EVs to go mainstream is with a automaker like Nissan or Chevy. The EAA used to quote some statistic about the average person who drives puts on less than 27 miles so both would work statistically at least for most to never need to visit a gas station.

The chevy volt to me is a great concept. Yes somewhat limited range but it has an range extender onboard so no worry about getting stranded. If folks find they can get around most or all of the time without gas maybe next go around or when they replace their second car in the family they'll get a full EV. I just wish the fit and finish on the car was better I hear it seems very cheap.

The leaf is said to do 100 miles which I'm sure it can do but on a windy, rainy day at highway speeds it may be alot less. So for now if one gets one they can only count on charging at home. If it is a second car in the family it might be good. If you rarely or never go longer than 50-60 miles in a day it could be your only car and you could rent something for that once or twice a year. I've heard millions of times every outlet is a charging station. Problem is no one will let you use their outlets even if you offer to pay 10 times the cost. Until there is a reliable public charging infrastructure that can dump out tons of power one can really only count on their home unless they are really lucky and can charge at work.

Is 100 miles the tipping point? I hope so. I hope a few people go out there and get one and are successful with it. I hope people look past the cheapness of the volt and give it a try and realize they only go to the gas station 3 times a year and maybe chevy ups the range a bit with further tech or companies start putting in little charging stations at work or maybe parking lots put in a few pay spots for low amp charging. I've been hoping forever with alot lower numbers then 100 though but maybe with all the tech that has come along it will gain a foothold this time.

I know there is a crop issue but I'm sure these gas prices will add to those produce prices which are already way out of hand. I'm just hoping some of those seeds sprout I setup.

[JKTex]

As one that bought an even $150 in diesel to fill up my truck today, I can say, diesel is all over the place. As for electric, I'm all for the 2 batteries it takes to crank mine. Beyond that, I've heard about some of the battery plants where some of the batteries, like for the Prius, come from. And when you look at the life cycle of one, it's hard to justify

I saw a comparison of a Hummer H2 and Prius and while I can't vouch for it's authenticity, it painted a pretty scary picture when it came to return on $$ and impact to the environment through EOL

That said, it can be done, the manufactures just need to be insented to do so. I'm anxious to see what the Volt does and I think there is/can be, a lot good ahead for Tesla.

[Uther]

As one that bought an even $150 in diesel to fill up my truck today, I can say, diesel is all over the place.

Seriously? Because we had a diesel vehicle in a different country and I'd like to have another. But I look at gas stations and not all (most?) don't have a diesel pump.

Help me out here. Can you name the gas stations on 407 (or 1171 - depends on where you drive) that serve diesel?

If we go on a road trip, I suppose we could fill up at truck stops.

[L-Dog]

The little market in Bartonville has a diesel pump. It is located on the very corner of the store building, not with the other gasoline pumps. I see a lot of the locals with diesel trucks filling up there when I stop in there for a breakfast burrito once in a while.

[JKTex]

As one that bought an even $150 in diesel to fill up my truck today, I can say, diesel is all over the place.

Seriously? Because we had a diesel vehicle in a different country and I'd like to have another. But I look at gas stations and not all (most?) don't have a diesel pump.

Help me out here. Can you name the gas stations on 407 (or 1171 - depends on where you drive) that serve diesel?

If we go on a road trip, I suppose we could fill up at truck stops.

They're everywhere. You don't need to go to a truck stop and as a matter of fact, most won't let you fill a passenger car. The pumps are high flow which I love. I can fill 40+ gallons in 3-4 minutes vs. 20.

Just about all Shell's have diesel, Valero, the FM Convenience store and that's just 4 with 2 miles of me. Most all out in the smaller towns do because of the demand. There are a tons of diesel trucks (99% of all Ford Super Duty's, most Dodge and much less % with GM HD trucks) and even cars (VW and Mercedes) around here.

[Common Sense Al]

I read something recently referring to how much technically accessible oil we have under the U.S. that isn't being tapped (technically accessible = oil that can be tapped using existing technology, processes, etc.). It stated that most attempts to drill are met with resistance from environmentalists (this we knew). But there was a hint that significantly powerful environmentalist organizations may be receiving funding from OPEC. Haven't done the research on this yet, but it's an interesting point to ponder. I'd like to learn more (validate) this info.

Funding by OPEC to any significant degree? Sounds a bit far-fetched, but I guess wouldn't be too surprising considering how much special interests (the ones that have $$ anyway) control things these days. If you have any luck validating that info, please let us know.

[evblazer]

Wonder if opec sponsored that h2 vs prius life cycle analysis too. Not that it is 100% false but everything is worst case scenerio on top of hype sort of like politics and marketing in general.
It really would be money well spent for opec in both cases maybe the environmental groups should ask them directly I know they are hard up for $.

[Common Sense Al]

Wonder if opec sponsored that h2 vs prius life cycle analysis too. Not that it is 100% false but everything is worst case scenerio on top of hype sort of like politics and marketing in general.
It really would be money well spent for opec in both cases maybe the environmental groups should ask them directly I know they are hard up for $.

I kind of figured that Hummer vs. Prius thing was mostly BS... but I would like to see a fair comparison... has one been done?

[neighbor]

I read something recently referring to how much technically accessible oil we have under the U.S. that isn't being tapped (technically accessible = oil that can be tapped using existing technology, processes, etc.). It stated that most attempts to drill are met with resistance from environmentalists (this we knew). But there was a hint that significantly powerful environmentalist organizations may be receiving funding from OPEC. Haven't done the research on this yet, but it's an interesting point to ponder. I'd like to learn more (validate) this info.

Funding by OPEC to any significant degree? Sounds a bit far-fetched, but I guess wouldn't be too surprising considering how much special interests (the ones that have $$ anyway) control things these days. If you have any luck validating that info, please let us know.

Two minutes into this, and it looks like a dead end. Googling "is opec funding environmentalists" turns up pages of links to some sort of chain email saying the the Bakken Formation in Montana could provide the U.S. with a thousand years of oil... I've lost interest.

[JKTex]

Wonder if opec sponsored that h2 vs prius life cycle analysis too. Not that it is 100% false but everything is worst case scenerio on top of hype sort of like politics and marketing in general.
It really would be money well spent for opec in both cases maybe the environmental groups should ask them directly I know they are hard up for $.

I was basically a simple life cycle cost of operation and ownership analysis. The Prius having an life cycle ending somewhere just under 100k miles with normal maintenance and the H2 being several 100k (as most cars are, if they're cared for). The biggest eye opener was the battery plant in Canada where Toyota gets/got the batteries from and the environmental disaster it is. Just think about all the battery plants around here and the environmental impacts being felt decades later. How about the Exide plant in Frisco and the pocket of a rare cancer just discovered, on top of the on and off problems they've had, and it's not a bad one.

I'll need to try to find it again. It's been a couple years and I never did dig into it. I'm not a H2 fan. They're all but worthless; H3 is even worse.